Managing Managers: How to Navigate the Jump from Manager to Director 7 | 32
What do you do when you suddenly have to manage managers? Kim, Jason, and Amy respond to a real-life leadership curveball: what happens when you...
3 min read
Brandi Neal Nov 1, 2022 12:01:04 AM
Table of Contents
Does anyone actually want to be a manager of managers? And if so, what do these people actually do? On this episode of the Radical Candor podcast Kim, Jason and Amy discuss strategies for being an effective manager of managers. If you're managing people who manage other people, then you're managing managers. Whereas if you're managing individual contributors, you're managing a team. The most significant difference when you become a manager of managers is that now you have to become a thought partner, not just on the functional expertise and the business your direct reports are running or the product that they're building, but you also have to be a thought partner to them on how they're managing their team.
Listen to the episode:
When you are a manager of managers, it’s your job to make sure not only that the authority you have doesn’t go to your head, but that authority doesn’t go to the heads of the people who work for you. In other words, you want to make sure that nobody on your team, including you, has unilateral decision-making power over who gets hired, who gets promoted, and who gets fired. You want to make these decisions as a team.
As you switch from direct management of individual contributors to managing managers, you’re going to face new challenges. When you become a manager, you can’t be in the details of every decision; when you become a manager of managers you don’t even know all the decisions that are being made.
When you become a manager you can’t solve every problem, when you become a manager of managers you may not even know about the problems that are getting solved and you have to let go of control.
You can’t have a personal relationship with every person your direct reports manage — and at some point, you won’t even be able to know everyone’s name. And, people may start to see you differently — perhaps as the big intimidating boss they have to perform for versus the nice person they used to say hi to in the coffee line.
Listen to the full episode to hear the team share their experiences of navigating these changing dynamics, including how Kim used to "crank call" members of her team.
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Episodes are written and produced by Brandi Neal with script editing by Amy Sandler. The show features Radical Candor co-founders Kim Scott and Jason Rosoff and is hosted by Amy Sandler.
The Radical Candor Podcast theme music was composed by Cliff Goldmacher. Order his book: The Reason For The Rhymes: Mastering the Seven Essential Skills of Innovation by Learning to Write Songs.
Sound editing by PodcastBuffs.
When you manage individual contributors, you focus on functional expertise, work output, and team dynamics directly. When you become a manager of managers, you must also become a thought partner on how your direct reports manage their own teams. You're no longer just guiding the work — you're guiding the people who guide other people, which means letting go of detailed control and trusting a layer of leadership between you and the frontline.
Managers of managers must ensure that no single person — including themselves — has unilateral decision-making power over who gets hired, promoted, or fired. These decisions should be made as a team. This helps prevent authority from going to anyone's head and keeps the process fair and transparent. Building that check into your team culture protects both the people on your team and the integrity of your organization.
It's not enough to simply ask for feedback — you have to make yourself open to public criticism and actively design systems that help people speak truth to power. As a manager of managers, you're setting the tone for every layer beneath you. If people see you accepting candid feedback gracefully and transparently, it signals that honest communication is safe throughout the organization. Structural tools like speak-truth-to-power meetings can help make this a reliable practice rather than a one-off gesture.
A bottoms-up OKR (Objectives and Key Results) process is a goal-setting approach where team members help define the goals rather than having them handed down from the top. For managers of managers, this is critical because you can't be close to every decision being made. When people at every level participate in setting goals, everyone is more aligned, more invested, and clearer on priorities — reducing the need for constant top-down oversight.
When hiring managers, make management skills an explicit part of the process from the start — include them in the job description, the interview questions, and especially the reference checks. The best tip from the Radical Candor team: call people who have previously reported to the candidate and ask what they really think of them as a manager. Past direct reports give you the most honest, ground-level view of someone's management abilities that you simply can't get from a standard interview.
Several challenges emerge when you make this transition: you won't know every decision being made, you won't know every problem being solved, and you may not even know everyone's name. You also have to accept that people may start to see you differently — as an intimidating authority figure rather than a peer. The key is letting go of control, trusting the managers beneath you, and focusing your energy on coaching them rather than doing the work yourself.
Three ways to put this into practice.
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